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tv   Hardball With Chris Matthews  MSNBC  January 17, 2017 4:00pm-5:01pm PST

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video and so much more. "hardball" starts now. feign and mestic. let's play "hardball." good evening, there are two loud voices across the country. vladimir putin accusing the obama administration of undermining legitimate of donald trump. john lewis openly denying trump's legitimacy. i part with putin. is it possible the russia dictator has no idea what the
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politics. is it possible that our cia is like his intelligence operation a political tool of the president. is it possible that putin think the media are directed by president obama the way rt are: what are boycotters saying. condemn what trump said what he promised to do. put tin weighted in intelligence and accused them by leaking 35 page dossier against donald trump. here it is. >> people who order such false statement that are being spread
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to come miez, those people are worst than prostitutes. they don't have moral boundaries. deal with such people on regular basis. this hasn't happened before. it indicates a significant level of degation of political elite in the west including the u.s. >> put tin charge accusation that trump made genls the intelligence community. trump questioned whether john brennan was the leaker of fake news. brennan decide responsibility for the leak and slammed trump for attacking the patriotism. agencies. tell the families of the 117 officers that they're loved ones were akinned to nazi. i find it to be repugnant and
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ill stand up for patriotism. >> breaking news late today, chelsea manning belonging to the united states. the president's communation sentence will expire this coming may. the panel analysts. what do you make of the decision just announced this evening? >> i was surprised. i was wonder with the tweet that wick leek put out a few days ago saming if he granted -- i done think
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that's going to happen. i think what motivated him was the harsh treatment she got after being arrested. i uld love to hear obama talk about it some more. >> i think it's an act of mercy. she has been cracking up in prison. he getting a lot of pressure on the left to do something, i think that's why he did it. >> i think it's an act of compassion. he did not pardon her. >> tell me the difference? >> you're still guilty, i'm letting you go. >> wikileaks came on the -- over the wikileaks. it was released
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to the public. that was first big massive leak. that was before wikileaks got into bed with russia. we can talk about later. i feel badly for this woman and i'm going to say she paid her price to society and now let's move on. we are not done with wikileaks. >> put tin has jumped into our politics again and saying that the obama administration which has been courteous to the incoming president, as of today, i'm rooting for the young men and women coming to town. but now the -- dictator of russia is saying our president are using the intelligence arms, what do duma do you make of this.
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>> i think this is wrong. i don't think putin wants a strong president trump. he wants chaos. he trying to sew discord against cia which is watching him. at the same time trying to allegation about fake and false. >> if i were trump i would make same charge against the intelligence agencs. >> listen, i agree wit you. i think he trying to cause chaos. >> does he want to weaken trump? >> yes. i think he wants to do anything he can. he sewed this chaos over the place. he a bad
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guy. we get that. >> first of all, vladimir putin, the speem people around him are trying to weaken america. >> is he going to be like a character in batman who keeps coming into our television sets and interfering with what's going on. is he going to be in our face? >> yes. he needs to understand he can be trapped by putin. putin want to weaken him and america. president-elect trump is going to rely on his people to warn him -- >> how long can trump, if you say he being duped by mr. produce timr. putin, how long can he dupe him?
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how long will that last. >> i think it will last as long as -- the minute putin does something that flies in the face of -- trump with be -- that would be like getting involved in iraq. it couldi be attacking -- people who are not in classic military uniform i like ukraine. the russian government, putin and his kremlin they we are at war already. it's a war to weaken america. we sound like weird does saying we're at war with russia. >> why are the russians afraid
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of us having -- they don't want us to have interba histic misl. what are they afraid of us doing. do they believe nato is going to attack russia? >> they do. they believe that war would be nato is inevitable. >> it's absolutely not. it's act reassure -- as they see it, yes. remember you know what they have done, they broken out of the nuclear treaty. to kind of ungeek that. in the 80s developed this missile. ronald reagan negotiated with them and got rid of them. they are not allowed to have those any more. we cannot fight by attacking in
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europe. they broke out of this treaty. that's a problem that ekt president-elect -- >> trump going to be president on friday. it's going to happen. what where does it take us? is he going to meet with muputi what coming of that, given what's been going on in the last couple of hours? >> let's hope cia under mike pompeo can declare peace and come up with a unified plan, especially in the middle east we do have to develop a belter relationship with the russian, that's not necessarily the worst-case scenario. i think that all of us have to
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understand, these are big stakes. the more we undermine our president, the more worse we are as a country. >> he told you that the cold war from their perspective is not over. we have to go to war with russia. it's lauk hawkish on it it. you have to recognize that this discord that put tin is telling across democracy you cannot say we're going to have a reset and move . they laughed at hillary clinton for that. this notion now you're following donald trump's lead because he has no idea what he is doing. name one republican who did that in the last eight years with barack obama on anything. don't
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come to say we have to get behind a guy who knows nothing about what we're talking about. -- don't tell me now -- >> as a country we need to come together. >> let them act like a president first. >> he is still our president. >> he going to be our president, he needs to start acting like it. >> now you come running along say we have to honor the presidency, we have to honor the -- this is out right -- >> what's smartest move for critics to take? >> based on the this psychology
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of it. you got to praise trump and tell how you're going to help him. >> child psychology. >> the conditions for reset are worst than they have been in -- >> great to have you all by the way. red army in world war ii. we had a big deal we can argue but we are had good deals. we found a way to work with them because kres chef was not crazy. we can work. is there any self-interest that putin has that we can share that may work for us? >> preserving state from -- we were trying. they want our
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information. >> i love the -- i'm glad to have an expert. thank you all. coming up the list of democrats boycotting, the list continues to grow. trump's war with the intelligence community. can trump administration rebuild that relationship. he needs to tell him what's going on in the world. democrats have a tricky path forward. how can they challenge without alienating- this is "hardball" where the action is. when it comes to healthcare, seconds can mean the difference
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womelcome back. boycotting donald trump's inauguration. one of those house, democrats skipping the event is congressman joining me from the hill. certainly not a hard lefty. wt puts you out there with john lewis who says the president is not legitimate. >> i struggle with this because i do treasure the peaceful transfer of power. between the russian interference with our election, all of this added up is say i can't celebrate the character traits of this man who will be our president on friday. >> what about the recognition,
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do you recognize him as our president come friday? >> i think we have to. this seems to be what the constitution says. so far there's no credible evidence that his election was not legitimate. we were reminding earlier we don't know what was in much of that classified data that came from russia. we'll see down the road. >> have you talked to the democrats do you have a sense there's a consensus as to they want this to do. in terms of consequence effect what good can it do. learn your lesson what is it your trying get out of trump, if anything. >> i'm not sure we're trying get anything out of trump. there's fear about the repeal of the
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affordable care act, about the assaults on federal employees. american 63 million have dying to have democrats stand up and say when you're wrong, we're going to fight you. >> as expert said, people do best work when being peaed on. what the work on why trump does it, they are going to be there. the question is how happy they are going to be, the moral. >> i'm going to go to work and do a bad job. if if you treat people with respect, when do good work. up next the war on intelligence community. this is "hardball" with the action is.
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it's not a good situation
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for our country, chris, to have president of the united states and soon to be commander in chief having this kind of concontentious relationship with the intelligence community. it's not good for the country or national security. >> welcome back to "hardball." once he sworn into office, president trump will need to rely on the top spy agencies to execute his policy. that requires both sides to rift -- he taking such offense. we don't expect our information to be swallowed whole. it's whallegation made about -- but in an interview in on this
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network, james woolsey said to brennan should tone it down. >> he's going to be the united states -- presint of the united states in four days. it would seem to me that a less angry response in public would have been far preferable. he is not doing a service by getting into the pit and getting angry back. i think he needs to speak respectfully to the soon to be president of the united states. >> i'm joined by jeremy bash, and -- let's talk about how whacky this is. the minute he gets that oath of office, he needs to know what's going on.
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his only source of information besides the news we have, is the cia. so how does he have this relationship develop here? >> it's the same intelligence professionals that provided the same -- his intelligence professionals are going to watching to see what china does, iraq does, he is going to need them. >> perhaps -- what i'm not sure what you're talking about. >> what brennan told me is we need a president who understan this is credible intelligence, how is he supposed to go forward and make a strategy. what do the
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allies think if openly -- how do we recruit people to spy for us. that does not inspire -- >> let me ask you a question. do you think trump doesn't know what objective truth is? >> i don't know. >> you're laughing, if someone called said tokyo is -- is questioning obvious information. >> he has been questioning on the sellable facts on what russia has been trying to do. every meeting starts with the fact, with an intelligence lay down briefed by the director of the cia director. they if he wipes that away and said i don't want to hear that. >> he is selectively -- do you
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think he is on the hook. >> he has on views about russia. >> people are all different. >> i practice words, iphone number if i repeat and go bill clinton like to get on paper, he didn't want anything talking him anybody ery morning, he want to read it. some guys are like that. trump seem to be a gee that doesn't want it any way. trump gets up 8 in the morning, and he wants to know what's going on that day, that he she know about, how se going to find
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out. >> there are talk about creating vide videos or sending messages. >> why would you do that? >> they want to give it to him any way he wants it. they don't care how it's presented. >> he said it's repetitive. >> there's a lot that you see from day-to-day that doesn't change. part of the problem the president needs to be informed on what is static and what is dynamic. >> they used to make movie for him because he was a movie guy. we're going to show you a movie about the guy. it's a quick way to teach someone. >> it's a complex world. i read cpp when i was at the pentagon.
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he doesn't understand what he going to get. it's in-depths articles that tells him what he needs to know. >> we have a president that c cannot trust his own spies. >> that will make a lot of people in the cia comfortable if mike pompeo is allowed to be adviser to the president. a lot of people i talked to at cia and can the intelligence community, look at that relationship says convey to the president what they think they need to know. >> how to get president a second opinion? >> he can get 15 opinions if we wants. >> if there's -- he may go outside of government, that's okay. he should get second
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opinions. he needs to bring the intelligence community into the fold. >> what are you tweeting at dawn the world leaders. >> he sets it for the world. >> thank you, jeremy bash and shain. up next, this "hardball" where the action is. my business was built with passion... but i keep it growing by making every dollar count. that's why i have the spark cash card from capital one. th it, i earn unlimited 2% cash back on all of my purchasing. and that unlimited 2% cash back from spark means thousands of dollars each year going back into my business... which adds fuel to my bottom line.
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here is what's happening. lloyd is wanted for murder of police officer and pregnant girlfriend. president-elect trump arrived in new york. betsy devos -- is expected to hold a vote on rex tillerson nomination on monday. on tuesday, the committee will vote on jeff sessions nomination to be general. as president 2:15 eastern. back to "hardball."
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welcome back to "hardball." next month, new leader for party. the race has become proxy fight. and the clinton, there's a dark horse in the race, he has been called brightest star, interesting mayor you never heard of or possibly gay -- south bend indiana. thank you sir. that same is fascinating. >> it's smith over there. >> you want to be chairman of the democraticational committee. >> yes. >> what makes you different?
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>> i'm 34. but my experience is local government. we need to get back to the states and the community. i don't think the solution is going to come interest washington on down. somebody who has the close to the ground experience can add something to the conversation here. >> here conversation we have been having here, you're from south bend. so let's ask football question. if have you had running hillary clinton campaign, how would you have changed carried wisconsin, michigan, indiana and other rust belt states she lost. how could she have won the states she needed to win. how could she have done it? >> first of all, you have to connect with people. that means
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not simply talking politician. people in my neighborhood going to be saying who talking me. we have to show up talk at the kitchen table where this hits home and how their lives will be affected. if climate change isn't something that happens to polar bears and happens on thousand year rainfall that counts as 2,000 rainfall any more. >> i'm big believer in rail. this country flat out country. i was on the train, we went right by there. it takes two and a half days. here my yes, trump saying going to rebuild america what's your answer?
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>> i believe it when i see it. >> what's your earn to are building america? >> we have to invest in everything from potholes to -- >> we didn't. why haven't the democrats build this country again? >> we have get back to that, there's no question. i have enough money to repave -- asphalt last only -- rewe have to reinvest in everything. i'm dnc chair isn't a policy job. this is an organizing job. i believe having perspective that i have as well as not being per received to belong to any camp, that's where we need to organize
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our future. >> good luck. thank you. mayor of south bend, indiana. three days before trump takes the office. "hardball" roundtable is coming up next. you're watching "hardball" where the action is. just like the people who own them, every business is different. but every one of those businesses will need legal help as they age and grow. whether it be help starting your business, vendor contracts or employment agreements. legalzoom's network of attorneys can help you every step of the way so you can focus on what you do. we'll handle the legal stuff that comes up along the way. legalzoom. legal help is here. safety doesn't come in a box. it's not a banner that goes on a wall. it's not something you do now and then.
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welcome back to "hardball." we are three days away from peaceful transfer of power. there's a 90% chance of rain.
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this weekend at least 24 protes groups have applied for permits to rally for the women's march witch comes on friday. political reporter, chief reporter. handshake to fellow gentleman when colleague. let's go to rising temperature on friday. john lewis is a rarity, a leader, it seems to spring forth a feeling people are responsible on the progressive side of things to get their act together and say i'm not going. it can go to a hundred. >> congressman lewis said what
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he said. president's elect reaction to john lewis is shocking. the fact that he is going after him, talking about his district, talking then -- >> how did you read into this. >> it's what trump has been saying at his all white rally. you live in getting shot, all of that have which has nothing to to with john lewis's district. when you go after someone who considered to be the conscience of congress, you have caused some trouble. donald trump could have earned himself some goodwill if he -- in this one instance turned the other cheek.
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the fact he didn't gave -- >> there's so many growing on the list. it's growing. >> john lewis said something, donald trump responded, that put john lewis in a position to lead the other members away from the inauguration. >> up in maine by the way trump supporter, governor mcpage had this to say about lewis during the interview. >> how about john lewis criticizing the president. i'll say this. it was abraham lincoln that freed the slaves, grant
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fought against, a simple thank you would suffice. >> i think he does have the full throated reality of trumpism there. >> as giner pointed out he got reflected after saying similar controversial things in the past. >> what the minority population of maine? >> he did get away with it. >> he said many controversial things and is a two-term governor. >> in the radical republicans and the reconstruction era is gone. >> when senator ted cruz gave his speech and talked about how
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wonderful the republican party was, all the great things republican party things for african-american stopped at '64. what have you done since then. the idea that the governor can say that, that's not demanding his resignation tells you about america 2017. >> the take away for democrats, it's utterly predictable. it should be a lesson for democrats going forward. so part it has not put him in steps in terms of uni unifying the country. you know
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ha he is going to escalate the battle if you take a shot at him. >> the question is vulnerability is key here. i notice a lot of african-american people i know, you get in their facial expression when you talk about talk. it is fear that he can do damage. there's some immediate fears with this guy, immediate. >> there is. i think that fear permeates a lot of the tone. when they hear john lewis who is an icon, criticized, they -- >> imagine in ferg son had happened under trump, ferg son
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to investigate. do you think we would have gotten two reports autoof a trump justice department that would have uncovered the 1950s era racism that people in that town from living under. that's why african-american and a lot of people of color are fearful of this -- >> you can't do it legislative four years later. >> yes. it's a matter of tone. we have been listening to donald trump since he announced his candidacy in 2015. we have been listening to -- when i say "we" i'm talking about african-american. his talk about us, at us, but not too us. if you want to reach african-american go to the african-american community and
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talk to them. unfortunately, president-elect trump has not been able to talk in a way that reveals that's someone not stuck with an 1980s view of african-american life or urban life. that's the fear you see in the eyes of african-american is eight years of, not great years, because we just launched week after week of african-americans being killed in police involved shootings, but there's a comfort that the person sitting in office understood. >> up next, this "hardball" where the action is.
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i'm back with the "hardball" round table. donald trump in an interview with the "wall street journal" recently said -- criticized this border tax, border adjustment tax that's a key centerpiece of the republican -- of the house republican tax reform. he said it's too complicated. my sources tell me that shocked republican leaders who had no idea he was going to disagree with them. it shows how difficult it's going to be for donald trump. >> what's a border tax? >> that has to do with whether imports are taxed on the back end or the front end and so this is something that they thought would be a way to incentivize people to do their manufacturing in the u.s. it was the centerpiece of tir plan, he doesn't like it. that surprised them. >> ginger? >> swamp draining status so far is that it seems to be getting fuller not more empty. we're seeing lobbyists start to register not knowing what to expect from donald trump and foreign governments, we saw as
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we reported this week that government of ukraine has hired former mississippi governor haley barbour at a $50,000 a month retainer so they are doing serious business here in filling up the swamp. >> $600,000 a year from kiev. >> from kiev to figure out what's going on. we saw the albanians hire to get inauguration tickets. >> jonathan? >> the atlanta business chronicle in february, 2010, ran a story about a project in atlanta that was going to be foreclosed. the headline "proposed trump tower site listed for foreclosure." guess where this site is? congressman john lewis' district. if it's such a hell hole, if it's so horrible, why was donald trump willing to give his architecture -- >> you clever liberals. you're so clever. thank you, jonathan cape heart, ginger gibson and ken vogel. when we return, trump watch for this tuesday night, you're watching "hardball."
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trump watch tuesday, january 17, 2017. the day of transition approaches, the da after torrow donald trump will be our president. all t king's horses and all the king's men cannot stop it. it's written in the constitution and it's going to happen. i say this not because i'm happy the noisy transition that clobbered us since election night, i remain impressed and encouraged by our rhythmic certitude of elections and changing of the guard. every two years since the
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ratification of the constitution we've had elections for congress. what we don't like, we can change in november of next year, actually, as obama told us, yes, we can. there's going to be a lot of protests against this transition of donald trump to the presidency. we'll see it before, during, and after the swearing in itself, on saturday people will be coming here for the women's march. call iends of people will be saying they don't like this man trump becoming our president. what i'm hoping for is members of congress see what good could be done this coming year and avert having something bad getting done. that will take pressure, briain and patriotism thrown in. one of my favorite maxims is something walt disney put in a movie long ago, something he believed himself. it's not what you've got, it's what you do with what you've got that counts. opposition, the right, smart, committed kind can play a life or death roll starting friday at noon. those who want to make the best at what's coming need to get their heads into it. if you care about the company you can skip the inaugural but you can't skip the hard work and
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smart politics of steering the next president to what truly needs doing and away from what no president should ever do. that's "hardball" for now. thanks for being with us. "all in" with chris hayes starts right now. tonight on "all in" -- >> no puppet. >> three days bore inauguration, vladimir putin stepsn to defend donald trump. >> vladimir putin's priorities are to restore the russian empire, stock? that's what they are. >> while the outgoing cia director blasts trump's attacks on the intel community. >> that's something nazi germany would have done and did do. with obamacare now more popular than health care. >> our core believes are what unite us. >> as new controversy facing trump's pick to lead that fight. ful senator chuck schumer joins me live. plus, obama's surprise announcement on chelsea manning. and


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